Classic Mode

Anything else
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mike
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Classic Mode

Post by mike » Fri Sep 23, 2016 4:45 am

Guys, I have a tough question to discuss.

Lack of some important UI features (like scrolls availability, independence of cursor position with scroll position, clickable column headers, clickable path line, thumbnails mode, accessibility etc etc - myriads of the them actually :() is becoming a major headache of mine.
That's because at the moment I've kinda stuck here with a custom written UI drawing/input handling. (mentioned in two topics already: http://magnumbytes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=137 and http://magnumbytes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=88).
That was entertaining to write it 3 years ago, and I still believe that NC provides nearly fastest UI possible in terms of performance (especially in Classic Mode - I even wrote own routines to draw monospaced text there), mostly thanks to my previous game development experience :)
So I have thoughts to pull the trigger, drop a handwritten UI and move to stock macOS controls there.
Surely, this will hit performance efficiency, but I think I can make it run smooth (not sure about directories with a 1,000,000 entries - as NC can handle currently, but nonetheless).
The problem is with Classic Mode - there's no way to make regular macOS controls to look like classic TUI (Norton, Volkov, FAR etc) and maintaining of two completely separate branches of UI would be a very heavy burden for me.

So I want to ask - is presence of Classic Mode in Nimble Commander crucial for you?
Current usage statistics shows that 10-20% of NC users prefer Classic Mode and simply dropping it is not fair.

Will gladly hear any opinion on this situation.
Thanks, Mike.

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darek
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by darek » Fri Sep 23, 2016 5:54 am

Hmm... I think I'd already voted my opinion on this here ;) http://magnumbytes.com/forum/viewtopic. ... assic#p104

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mike
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by mike » Fri Sep 23, 2016 6:05 am

Darek, thanks for reminding me about that topic! :)
I'm absolutely agree with your point, but concerns about folks who use Classic Mode are still valid.

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deseven
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by deseven » Fri Sep 23, 2016 7:38 am

I don't really care about classic mode.
Still, as a coder, i do know how hard it is to write a good control from scratch and don't make it look out of place.

I see some other options anyway. For example, you can use column headers from NSTableView in modern view and leave everything else intact. It should be pretty easy to sync columns' resizing with your handwritten UI. Scrollbars and other stuff aren't that easy, yeah... But i think that's a good compromise right now.

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mike
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by mike » Fri Sep 23, 2016 9:59 am

Thanks for your opinion, deseven!

The sad truth is that column headers are just tip of the iceberg :(
I surely can add them to Modern presentation, but this will immediately introduce a disparity between functionality of Modern and Classic modes - currently they are almost equal.
I thunk such half-measures will lead Classic mode to some abandoned/outdated/deprecated state anyway.

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deseven
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by deseven » Fri Sep 23, 2016 10:14 am

migun wrote:I surely can add them to Modern presentation, but this will immediately introduce a disparity between functionality of Modern and Classic modes - currently they are almost equal.
I thunk such half-measures will lead Classic mode to some abandoned/outdated/deprecated state anyway.
True, but they don't have to be equal. Right now classic mode doesn't show file icons and also have a little different layout. For me it's kinda logical for "classic" mode to be more keyboard-oriented without all that new fancy stuff (such as clickable columns).
I'd say don't drop what you already have, since it's already working and 10 to 20 percent of users is a really huge number.

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darek
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by darek » Mon Sep 26, 2016 8:58 am

If it was my call, I'd just drop the classic mode. I only see the code for these two running more and more apart as macOS and Nimble Commander evolve. And supporting both will be more and more costly. It's a tough price to pay for a trip down the memory lane ;) Frankly, I don't think people consider the classic mode essential for this tool. They probably just find it "nice". They're using Nimble Commander because of the file management POWER, not for the sentimental shade of blue.

And don't get me wrong, I'm not dissing the sentimental. Nor the blue! :) I've been a Norton Commander user back before it grew up to be blue and was still amber! (yay, monochrome Hercules PC monitors)

Just take a hint from Apple and drop the deadweight :) You're just one guy. Focusing will allow you to move forward faster.

Especially if it makes it easier to support things like the "brief view mode": http://magnumbytes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=71

d0ublezer0
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by d0ublezer0 » Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:10 pm

I apologize for my opinion, but I vote for the modern scheme, even just without explanation. I'm sorry, but I do not understand, why use an outdated interface appearance.

In my opinion, it is much more effective to maintain a modern look with great potential, to use from built-in operating system functions without the need to build upon the "crutches"

Now, you can throw tomatoes at me )

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mike
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by mike » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:57 am

Well all these thoughts are very reasonable and I'm close to agree and drop the bomb on source code :)

Still hoping to hear anything from folks who actually uses the classic presentation mode.
Guys, please?

moonrak
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Re: Classic Mode

Post by moonrak » Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:46 pm

Hi,
I have just registered to the forum because of the impending danger of losing Classic Mode.
When using Windows 7 (corporate laptop), ZtreeWin is my choice.
When using my Mac Mini and MacBook Air, Nimble Commander "Classic" kicks in.
Long live classic mode. A simple non-distracting interface.
This is the main reason why I bought Nimble Commander.
Regards,
moonrak

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